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NF-Lee's Gildor and Frodo

The Houses of Healing Pt. 1: Frodo wakes ~ jan-u-wine’s “Naught to be Forgiven”.

Posted on 2007.10.31 at 00:46

Comments:


pearlette
pearlette at 2007-11-02 10:20 (UTC) (Link)
It gives a deep reading of the relationship between the two, the nature of sacrificial service-asking it and acquiescing to it both.

Yes. Gandalf was an emissary from the Valar in the Third Age, a servant of Eru, no less. It's never spelt out, but that is what he is, and it explains his deep wisdom.

I'm afraid I do find the film laugh cheesy. Not at first, but then it goes on too long. It's all a matter of taste. :) I love the laughter in the book, it's beautiful and moving.

Although they have said repeatedly, actors and director, that they did not mean to portray Sam and Frodo in love with each other, they had to have known the prolonged shot of their mutual smiles would be perceived by many as lover-like. No, they bit the bullet and went ahead and portrayed two people of the same sex who loved each other with a devoted, even tender, love, who had been through hell together and did not care if the world knew. They did not try to water their affection down, or cover it up, with lots of slaps on the back.

Oh, I think it is absolutely BRILLIANT that the film-makers included That Look. Very bold ... and very canon. :)

Even without being a slasher, I think it's absolutely beautiful and thank the film gods that it was included in the final cut.

Amen!
Mechtild
mechtild at 2007-11-02 23:46 (UTC) (Link)
Yes. Gandalf was an emissary from the Valar in the Third Age, a servant of Eru, no less. It's never spelt out, but that is what he is, and it explains his deep wisdom.

Well-put! I suppose that is a big difference between the way Gandalf's commissions Frodo (and countless others) for life-threatening work and Albus Dumbledore. Although, to be fair, Rowling seems to portray her mentor-character as having a finger on the pulse of whatever is her god-concept. It's not my god-concept. Any character in league with my god-concept would never think it o.k. to ask a confederate to perform a mercy killing for him; he might gratefully accept being granted a merciful death as a free gift, but not one that he has commanded of someone else. But Rowling, I must assume, thinks this o.k., and that her larger scruples are o.k. with it. Clearly, Dumbledore is a good guy in her story, in spite of his many failings, and he would not ask of another a truly bad thing. I think he asked a bad thing. Again, if it were a matter of Snape offering to do it, as a friend, as an act of mercy, it would be one thing. But to command it of a clearly unwilling Snape is very, very problematic.
pearlette
pearlette at 2007-11-03 17:20 (UTC) (Link)
But to command it of a clearly unwilling Snape is very, very problematic.

No kidding!!!!!!!!! It is HUGELY problematic. It's horrible. No love, Albus, no love. (And it's all the more distasteful because the old codger is always banging on about the power of love, yadda yadda.) I love the characters Rowling has created, and really care about them, but the morality in her stories is downright bizarre at times.

There is a huge thing going on in HP fandom, which I'm currently participating in, to redeem Snape and give him the happy ending denied him in canon. Sound familiar? :p

Although it's very different, really. I think Tolkien handles Frodo with kid gloves compared to how Rowling dispenses with Snape! At least Tolkien seems to have some respect for his characters ...!

By way of contrast, here's an icon of one of my favourite ladies in LotR, one whose counsel I would trust and respect greatly. She's awesome. :)
Mechtild
mechtild at 2007-11-03 21:04 (UTC) (Link)
Well, she's the author of your book, not mine. Just goes to show how important a person's set of beliefs and premises are for the way their creative work plays itself out.

Hey, you're giving Snape a happy ending? This reminds me of the Nicholas Nickleby from 1981 or 82 (around the time of the BBC LotR!), in three evenings at the RSC, but filmed for TV. (I only saw it on VHS tapes years later.) In it Nicholas joins a Victorian acting company that does a version of Romeo and Juliet in which the two lovers don't die but leap up to a happy ending. Looking for the date of that, I noticed that the music was by Stephen Oliver--didn't he do the music for the BBC LotR?

And BEST of all, I saw that Smike, who was so, so terrific in that, was played by David Threlfall. I knew I had seen that name somewhere when I was watching the credits for "Elizabeth: The Golden Age" (had great fun watching it-saw that in LA, too). He played Dr. John Dee; I loved him, and looked for his name in the credits. "That name's familiar," I said. What's cooler is that I was telling jan-u-wine various reasons why I had liked the Laurence Olivier "King Lear" so much better. It had a much better supporting cast, I said. "I espcially remember just loving the character of Edgar, whereas the Edgar in this production is completely foregettable". Looking up David Threlfall, going from the Nicholas Nickelby link, I see it was *he* who played Edgar in that 1983 production. *Swoon* anew for David Threlfall.
pearlette
pearlette at 2007-11-04 08:27 (UTC) (Link)
Well, she's the author of your book, not mine.

*looks puzzled* :)

Just goes to show how important a person's set of beliefs and premises are for the way their creative work plays itself out.

I find Jo Rowling's rather muddled. :) No disrespect intended to her as a person. :)

Stephen Oliver--didn't he do the music for the BBC LotR?

The very same guy. :)

And David Threlfall is a wonderful actor. :)
Mechtild
mechtild at 2007-11-04 14:20 (UTC) (Link)
Well, she's the author of your book, not mine.

I was brushing her off in an unworthy manner. I meant, "I'm not a fan, so I needn't concern myself with her book's amgiguous morality." Sorry to be supercilious, and sorry to be unclear.

Ah, Stephen Oliver. Some of his music was so right; some of it...not. I will say I loved every bit of music he wrote for the hobbits to sing. Which makes me think he was very well-versed in, or comfortable with, the folk song tradition of England.

Now that I've been reminded of who he is as a young actor (Smike, Edgar), I'm thinking I ought to see what else I can watch that he's in--David Threlfall, I mean.
pearlette
pearlette at 2007-11-05 10:50 (UTC) (Link)
Ah, Stephen Oliver. Some of his music was so right; some of it...not. I will say I loved every bit of music he wrote for the hobbits to sing. Which makes me think he was very well-versed in, or comfortable with, the folk song tradition of England.

Stephen Oliver's hobbit-music is perfect. I love the oh-so-haunting melody for 'The Road Goes Ever On', which melts sweetly into the ballad 'Farewell we call to hearth and hall', before the tune changes back to that poignant minor key again and 'The Road Goes Ever On' ... those sad, haunting cellos.

Very few people, if any, like the shrieking Eagle. I have an Austrian friend whom I used to converse with a lot on the Imladris forums who loves it. She thinks it's bold. That's one way of putting it. :p

She was also the first person I ever heard to diss Robert Stephens' Aragorn, and after a while I realised she had a point. :D

I was lucky enough to see Stephens as Lear, in 1993. He was AMAZING. One of his last ever performances. It was unforgettable, and the supporting cast were marvellous too ... better than the cast accompanying McKellan, it seems, according to what you say. :)
Mechtild
mechtild at 2007-11-05 13:38 (UTC) (Link)
Oh, "The Road Goes Ever On!" But don't forget the two songs Sam sings: Gil-galad was an Elven-king, and In Western Lands. Those are both engraved in my aural/emotional memory.

I didn't like his Aragorn either, but I would love to have seen him as Lear. It's his tender stuff as Aragorn that really works for me (the leave-taking of Boromir, the lovely lovely reading of the Lay of Lúthien, for example). Lear has many moments in which to make use of a talent for deeply-felt introspection.
pearlette
pearlette at 2007-11-06 09:41 (UTC) (Link)
Oh, his Lear was all of that. I've never forgotten it. The final scenes with Cordelia made me weep!

'Gil-galad was an Elven-king', and 'In Western Lands'. Those are both engraved in my aural/emotional memory.

Mine too. Absolutely beautiful songs.
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